Let me, Devil’s Advocate, clarify
The real issues here:
- A minor issue: clearly consensual sex with fully conscious, intelligent, non-drugged adolescents gets heavily punished, totally blown out of proportion
- while real dangerous violent totally non-consensual crimes like high school bullying, gang intimidation and violence only get minor attention.
- additional issues were entrapment, vigilanteism, sensationalism, sloppy evidence gatering. The “perpetrators” get enticed by the “victims”, the fake young kids, who never resisted any advances, and came on fairly strongly: “bring condoms”, “yes, I let you f… me in the a… if you love me”
- which comes back to the question if young kids of 17, 15, 13 years are really such helpless little creatures with absolutely no responsibility for their actions (in the same USA 12 year old criminals are often tried as adults, but they are unable to consent to sex)
I agree that probably there needs to be some restriction on sexual interaction of older with the young, or sex between young people. But non-consensual violent behavior of high school bullies, neighborhood gangs, criminal organizations is 1000 times more problematic and inescapable.
What about dedicating our scarce law enforcement resources to such uncontested undeniable problems? “To catch a highschool bully”, “to catch high school mobbing” or “to catch a gang assault”, or “to catch a rapist”.
To Catch a Predator was a reality television show that featured a series of hidden camera investigations by the television news-magazine Dateline NBC devoted to the subject of identifying and detaining those who contact people they believe to be below the age of consent over the Internet for sexual liaisons. Men are lured to meet with a decoy under the pretense of sexual contact. The investigations, many of which have been reported by Dateline correspondent Chris Hansen and producer Lynn Keller, are conducted as an undercover sting operation with the help of online watchdog group Perverted-Justice. Since the third installment, law enforcement and other officials have also been involved in the operation, leading to the arrests of most individuals caught in the sting. In an interview with NPR’s Neal Conan on Talk of the Nation, Chris Hansen emphasizes that the subjects of his program should be labeled as sexual predators: “We don’t label these guys as pedophiles. Pedophiles have a very specific definition, people who are interested in prepubescent sex. What we’re talking about here are potential predators.”
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_Catch_a_Predator (worth reading in entirety)
First a parody on “Catch a Predator” by NBC with the group “Perverted Justice”.
I think the parody tells better what this whole TV series is about. A guy that thinks straight, like a normal person 25 years ago, before the onset of the witch hunt for underage Teen Sex.
Wanting Sex with a willing consenting 17 year old, a heinous crime?
Now if you got brainwashed by the regular press, you might agree with “to catch a predator”. That TV series catches guys who want to have sex with a 12-13 year old girl who shows great willingness to engange in a sexual encounter, who does not resist to the guy’s advances at all. These “victims” who seem to have quite a mature behavior, are just one step short of actually hitting on the guy to have sex (which would still make her a “victim” according to today’s laws, punishable by 5-10 years in jail and mandatory life long registration as a sex offender). Interestingly, it is a thought crime, apparent “intent to have sex with a minor” is enough to ruin a life forever, even if the decoy on the internet chat is an 18 year old girl, or a 47 year old guy.
Why is there no registration for violent dangerous non-sexual offenders? Robbers, psychopaths, bullies, drunk troublemakers?
The press, and government have been brainwashing the public by trying to equate having sex with a willing, horny, and consenting 17 year old (or 15 year old in Europe where the age of consent usually is 16, up from 12 a few decades ago) with violent rape and killings of 7 year olds (which obviously always was a crime)
‘To Catch a Predator’: The New American Witch Hunt for Dangerous Pedophiles
Rolling Stone/July 30, 2007
[…] Twenty-eight men are caught in the bust, and the local prosecutor’s office brings charges against all of them. If they’re convicted, their sentences for attempted sexual assault will range from five to ten years in prison.
In direct response to the high-profile success of To Catch a Predator, laws against online predators have become increasingly hostile: Internet solicitation of a minor is now a crime in a majority of states, regardless of whether an actual minor is involved. By 2009, at least 600,000 of the country’s convicted sex offenders — including those who, like Donnelly, never met an actual minor — will be required by a new federal law, the Adam Walsh Act, to be listed on a national registry of sex offenders. There, on easy-to-navigate maps for the entire country, their photos and home addresses will appear next to categories such as aliases, sentence and “computer used.” Republican Sen. Orrin Hatch even thanked Perverted Justice for “directly impacting” the law’s passage.
Twenty-four states now forbid sex offenders from living near a host of public places — including schools, parks, day-care centers and bus stops — effectively shutting them out of many cities. Florida and Oklahoma require some sex offenders to submit to GPS monitoring for the rest of their lives. Ohio lawmakers even tried to pass a bill in 2005 to force sex offenders to sport pink license plates on their cars, but pressure from Mary Kay cosmetics, whose logo is pink, stymied the plan. This year, legislators are trying again with fluorescent-green plates.
This is much to the glee of Perverted Justice, which views child sex abuse as a vastly underrated evil, one deserving of harsher punishment. “I’m just a guy working within the Constitution to make the world a better place, using my freedom of speech to chat with individuals on the other end of the screen name,” says Frag. “How much more gratifying does it get than finding guys who are about to molest children and putting them in jail? Not many Americans have that.” http://www.rickross.com/reference/perverted_justice/perverted_justice36.html
Former district attorney committed suicide when Swat raids his house
Is it possible that Bill Conradt, an adult pretending to be a teenager, might have suspected, correctly, that “Luke” was also an adult pretending? Yes: Everybody knows that the Internet is a swamp of false identities. And is there any evidence that Conradt had ever acted on the longings that his chats illuminated? On the contrary, he chose not to when presented with the opportunity. Was it morally wrong for Bill Conradt to engage in online sex chats with an apparent child? Of course. But did his actions merit the response to them? Before answering this question, a man should take stock of the history of the desires he’s never acted on, and whether he should ever have to defend that history in court, or see it detailed on television.
Read more:http://www.esquire.com/features/predator0907-12 a long article with 12 parts 1|2|3|4|5|6|7|8|9|10|11|12
To Catch A Predator investigated by 20/20 pt. 1
While NBC might actually be moved by greed, Devil’s Advocate admits that most people involved did the setup with good intent to rid the world of “sexual predators”. But the zeal seems to have gone overboard, they helped create the predators they were trying to extinguish:
To Catch A Predator investigated by 20/20 pt. 2
Arrested for desiring to have sex with a 21 year old decoy pretending to be 13
After seeing the parody, be prepared for the real show. Here is a 21 year old “victim” actor, pretending to be a 13 year old boy. Still, just meeting him with an alleged intent to have sex with him is a heinous crime, punishable with 5-10 years in prison.
Interestingly, if the “victim” were a 13 year old boy pretending to be a 21 years old, they “perpetrator” would still be in very deep trouble. You need to check ID before you propose to someone.
Several Swat stings, summarized.
“What is a 24 year old doing looking for a 13 year old?” “3 felony counts, including transmitting images harmful to a minor”.
I, as Devil’s Advocate, think the “perpetrator” acts a bit in bad taste. But for the mere thought crime, should he really be punished more harshly then a gang member who routinely severely beats and robs up passers-by? NBC makes sure it looks bad, by making the girl 13, but the same legal situation would occur with a 22 year old who seeks to meet a 17 year old. Maybe the guy wanted to check out the girl if she looks and behaves mature, before acting?
Maybe it is the parent’s duty to watch over their kids and to enlighten them so the minors do not engage in such self-endagering behavior. While the people nabbed by Dateline seem fairly harmless creatures, who look for consensual sexual activities, kids could invite real predators, I mean guys who really rape, mutilate, rob and destroy.
It is amazing how these consensual sex crimes get totally blown out of proportion, so much that the law perverts language to call consensual sex with an adolescent (statutory) “rape”. Don’t we have real problems? Like gangs who intimidate entire neighborhoods and force kids to join them or else? Nothing consensual about this. But we need to dedicate all this effort to consensual “crimes”?
Jailed for meeting an 18 year old pretending to be a willing 13 year old
In Florida it is illegal to use a computer to attempt to solicit a child for sex. No need to do anything. And no need even for the alleged child to really be a child. No matter how willingly the girl agreed that she was going to do all the things she saw in a porn movie.
Again, there is some legitimate concern here, I understand that maybe some limits need to be put up. But all is totally overblown. We have much more pressing problems in this world, of real non-consensual dangerous violence and long term intimidation. Hard core violent high school bulllies are a much more serious problem.
“You know what the intent was, you know what these guys would be doing had there been a real teenager, and not Dateline NBC”. Yes, he tried to get laid. With a young youth, but consensually. With a homosexual boy, if I said this is in bad taste I would be persecuted for the crime of “homophobia”. He brings condoms. “What does that say about your intent?”, asks Chris Hansen from Dateline NBC? The boy asked for condoms, what does that say about the alleged boy’s intent, says “Devils Advocate”. Again, the young age might be a problem, but not a bigger problem like a violent break-in into the house, with suffers less sanctions.
“pleaded guilty to attempting to entice a minor to have sex”, with a minimum sentençe of 5 years. If he were going to someone’s house with the intent to rob him, or to beat him into pulp, sentencing would be much more lenient. Probably no conviction at all unless he started attacking.
A critical TV report about “Catch a predator” and the group “perverted justice”.